Just One More Voice

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An open discussion forum for those who have assented to the covenant offered through Denver Snuffer to write and / or adopt by mutual agreement a statement of principles as a guide and standard.
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truth
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2015 3:07 am

Just One More Voice

Post by truth » Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:26 am

Father, open my eyes.

I have not followed the G&S situation closely from the beginning. I've only done my "duty" to read and to vote my conscience, but it seems to me that most of what are put up as "guides and standards" are just that--handbooks of instruction--when the Lord, to my mind, didn't ask for such and already said that His scriptures are sufficient for that purpose.
"When you have an agreed statement of principles I require it to also be added as a guide and
standard for my people to follow"

"I have given to you my doctrine, and have also revealed teachings, commandments, precepts, and principles to guide you and it is not meet that I command you in all things—reason together and apply what I have given you and it will be enough."

"Study my words and let them be the The Covenant standard for your faith"

"Receive the scriptures approved by the Lord as a standard to govern you in your daily walk in life"

"Use the scriptures to correct yourselves and to guide your words, thoughts and deeds"
(A&C).

In other words, use the scriptures for your handbook of instructions.

What He has asked for, again to my mind, is not the regurgitated answers that can be memorized or found in the book or copied from your neighbor. This is an open-book test (if you will). Therefore, what He has asked for is "an agreed statement of principles"--the reasons the answers are what they are. He is asking if we understand who God is and wants to know upon which ideologies we stand. Do we uphold the principle of charity or love (for "God is love" John 2:2)? If so, we have the golden rule to define love. Do we uphold the principle of choice or freedom to worship as we will--without coercion or compulsion? Do we uphold the principle of truth (of seeking to find it and never knowingly misrepresenting the reality)? Do we uphold the principle of mercy (of self-sacrifice and interceding on behalf of others)? Do we uphold the principle of hope--having even "a perfect brightness" (2 Nephi 13:5)?

Faith, repentance, obedience. Worshipping not ourselves.

The Lectures on Faith and the actions and words of our Christ both allow us to understand who God is, but that alone is not sufficient. We also have to show that we are willing to become as God is, "not only to say, but to do that which [Christ] has written" (D&C something or other).

Anyway, I do not have a formal "statement of principles" written, although I think one could be written and easily agreed upon, "a light thing" indeed, even by 100% of Christ's people if in deed any of us can ever be called such.



log
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Re: Just One More Voice

Post by log » Thu Nov 30, 2017 11:55 am

Disclosure: Truth is married to me, and we do not necessarily see eye-to-eye.

Truth,

I once wrote an essay, which now bears the title "The Simplified Gospel," to explain why the answers are what they are. It was my hope by publishing that essay, along with KJV Luke 6:20-49, to preach the tidings of salvation to millions. I failed in that hope - not by failing to finish the essay, but by casting it away, and substituting something else in its place for publication.

If I thought the covenant participants as a body would receive anything that I wrote, I would have stuck with my original proposal, "Building Up Zion," wherein that essay is found. Perceiving that the body would receive nothing from me, I instead replaced that essay with an equivalent statement by Christ - the doctrine of Christ as found in 3 Nephi 11:30-40 - and retitled the proposal as The Rock of Jesus Christ: A Statement of Our Principles.

This is why the answers are what they are.
The Simplified Gospel

The ways humanity tries to bring about justice, peace, and unity do not and cannot work. History and current events are proof that competing against, controlling, or manipulating others always results in disunity, conflict, injustice, and inequality. Yet competition, force, and manipulation are how humanity has chosen to govern itself. Jesus offers us the sole alternative to humanity’s self-destructive ways: love.

The law of God is this: every last thing you wish others would do to you, do those exact same things to them. This law defines the behavior of perfect love, which is called “charity.” God’s law is the true moral and ethical standard of all humankind, being written into every conscience, and it is the definition of “good.” Behavior that falls short of this law is not good and produces both guilt and conflict with others.

The purpose of the law of God is to end conflict between people. Those who willingly keep His law may joyfully and peacefully live together as equals, both here and now, and forever in the eternal world. The commandments that Jesus gave us in the Sermon on the Mount are how we are to obey the law of God through our works and end our conflicts with others.

Love, the feeling which makes us want to do what the law of God commands, is given to us by God. Charity is Jesus’s nature, meaning He feels perfect love towards everyone. Charity is the nature of all those who inherit God’s kingdom with Jesus. Jesus’s commandments in the Sermon on the Mount are the actions which those who have charity do by nature.

“Sin” is intent or action which falls short of the law of God, such as giving in to lust and doing to others what we do not wish others would do to us. “Repent” means to change one’s mind, to reconsider, or to relent, all of which implies a willing change in one’s behavior.

Any who will believe Jesus’s words in the Sermon on the Mount as literally as small children believe their parents’ words, and repent of all their sins, and be baptized by one of His sent servants, shall be visited by God with fire and with the Holy Ghost and shall receive a remission of their sins.

The visitation of the Holy Ghost changes our feelings so that we understand Jesus’s love and want to only do good. Then we are to do what Jesus commands until the end of our lives. We trust in Jesus to guide and comfort us in our trials and afflictions as we learn who and what He is by the things we suffer in obedience to His teachings. Just as one does not learn a new skill without practice, nobody can understand nor master the discipline of perfect love without doing its works. Doing the works Jesus commanded until we fully understand Him and freely agree to become what He is and to receive His nature from Him permanently as a gift by His grace so that we love everyone perfectly just like He does is what it means to be a disciple of Jesus.

If you keep the commandments of Jesus Christ, you are His church (Matthew 7:24-25, 16:18; Luke 6:47-48), you are His disciple (John 8:31-32), you are His friend (John 15:14), and you are His family (Luke 8:19-21).
Jared Livesey



truth
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2015 3:07 am

Re: Just One More Voice

Post by truth » Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:45 pm

Nor do we necessarily see nose to nose (as Jared is much taller.) :D



truth
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2015 3:07 am

Re: Just One More Voice

Post by truth » Thu Nov 30, 2017 6:10 pm

Log,
I would receive The Simplified Gospel as a statement of principles exactly because it does reflect principles, not rules. If one of our principles is that we strive to have the Holy Ghost as our guide and we value the words of Christ above all as known through personal revelation and the scriptures, while maintaining everyone's right to receive light and to even be deceived, and only rejecting the idea that someone else's revelation supercede mine, why not? As you know, I think it is beautiful.



log
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Location: Bakersfield, CA
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Re: Just One More Voice

Post by log » Thu Nov 30, 2017 6:43 pm

Truth,

Well, here's why not. The body as a whole is deeply suspicious of every mortal except one. And I'm not that one.

So the issue with accepting The Simplified Gospel isn't with its truth, clarity, usefulness, goodness, light, or anything like that - quite the opposite, in fact: the problem is the people rejecting anything unless it comes from the one living person they trust in.

Which is why I removed it from my G&S proposal and replaced it with a verbatim statement of the doctrine of Christ. It's less useful because the language is not modern English, and the explanations are missing, but it is bodily lifted from the scriptures.



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